Engineering Influence from ACEC

A Conversation with Chair Peter DeFazio, Chairman of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee

 
ACEC was honored to welcome Rep. Peter DeFazio, Chair of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee onto the show to discuss the next steps for the bipartisan infrastructure bill and budget reconciliation in the House.
Transcript:
Host: Welcome to Engineering Influence, a podcast from the American Council of Engineering Companies. Today, we are honored to be joined by a longtime friend of ACEC and the engineering industry and a strong advocate for America's infrastructure, House Transportation and Infrastructure Chair Peter DeFazio, who has represented Oregon's 4th Congressional district since 1987.
Chair DeFazio is a powerful advocate for transformative federal infrastructure investment and consequential action on climate change. He drafted the INVEST in America Act, which passed the House in early July and became the vehicle for the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, which cleared the Senate last week. With passage of that bill, the issue of infrastructure once again squarely lands in the House, which is expected to return from the August district work period later this month to address it, as well as a budget reconciliation bill. 
I'm also pleased to be joined by ACEC CEO Linda Bauer Darr for today's conversation. Thank you both for taking time to join the podcast today.
And with those introductions out of the way, I will throw it over to Linda for the conversation.
Linda Bauer Darr: Great. Thanks for doing this, Jeff. And thank you, Chairman DeFazio for being with us. When we were getting started, you mentioned that you just adopted a dog, a Labrador. So, what's the dog's name?
Chair DeFazio: Liddy. She's now learning her name. She came from a pound in Texas. They named her Lydia, and we've stuck with it.
Linda Bauer Darr: So, you're sticking with it. So how old is she?
Chairman DeFazio: A year and a half. The story was that she had pups and was in the kennel with the pups. The pups got adopted. She didn't. They put her on a transport, she came to Oregon, and we got her. So there are a lot of dogs in Texas that are apparently neglected.
Linda Bauer Darr: Well, you've joined a long line of people who have adopted pets during COVID. I'm down one pet during COVID, so I'm on the other side of that fence, but congratulations, and I'm sure you will have a great time with Liddy.
Linda Bauer Darr: We'll go ahead and get started. You were able to secure passage of the Invest Act in the House. By the way, great job. I know that was a Herculean effort. No doubt that had an impact in showing people that the bipartisan package was on its way and that it was going to make it through the Senate. What stands out to you as the most important provision that you secured in the bill? Or what would you be most proud of?
Chair DeFazio: First that we went through a real legislative process. We were in committee for a total, I think, of close to 60 hours over the two years. Hundreds of amendments in committee, hundreds of amendments on the Floor. An actual legislative process. Yeah, I didn't get a lot of Republicans for it in the end, but quite a number of their amendments were included in the bill, in contrast to the Senate bill written behind closed doors principally by people who don't even serve on the committees of jurisdiction in the Senate. So, you know, my bill was transformative. It was really to take the country beyond Eisenhower 8.0 and into the 21st century for transportation policy, dealing with climate change, resilience, and social equity and creating one whole hell of a lot of jobs. Unfortunately, their bill is Eisenhower 8.0 for the most part with a little green dressing on the side,
Chair DeFazio: There's more money spent on subsidies for fossil fuels in their bill than on alternative fuels. When you add it up properly you know, they, they say that 25 percent of the zero-emission bus policy has to be spent on polluting buses. Half of the $18 billion for fossil fuel reduction can be transferred to highways. There are a number of provisions like that in their bill. Their bill is slightly bigger on highways than mine, but way less on rail and transit and way less on social equity, way less on wastewater drinking water and lead pipes, which came out of Frank Pallone's committee. So we're going to deal with those deficiencies in Reconciliation, which is in part why we're pairing the two.
Chair DeFazio: Reconciliation is going to continue a lot of the democratic agenda. I'm unwilling at this point to pass this bill without some changes. It's been made clear that the cabal who wrote it are not interested in going to regular order and having a conference. That the chairs of the committees of jurisdiction in the Senate were not consulted during the drafting is an absolute insult to them, to the legislative process, and to the House of Representatives. And it's not how you get the best legislation when a group of people write something behind closed doors. So we're going to do our best to fix it.
Linda Bauer Darr: I will applaud you on regular order. I think people who have been in Washington for a long time have been very eager to get us back into that good rhythm. And even if neither the Senate nor the House has the perfect bill, the fact that we're exercising those muscles again, I think is hopeful. So, you talked a little bit about Reconciliation and you know, how you're going to marry these things. Can you talk a little bit more about that and the strategy and how you think that's going to work?
Chair DeFazio: Reconciliation is going to go through—at least in the House—a committee process. I assume it will in the Senate. It came out of the Budget Committee. The House will pass the budget, and then the committees of jurisdiction will be given their apportionments and we'll work through a legislative process committee-by-committee to put together a bill by mid-September. I think the deadline for us to have legislated our parts is the 15th of September. I'm going to mark up on the 12th of September in my committee.
Chair DeFazio: And I'm dealing with the White House since there have been some vague pledges that I'm not quite sure of from the President saying no more money for things that are in this bill, but I didn't make that agreement and I think there are ways to work around that. It can be just a little bit different but I'm working to add back money to transit. We got $100 billion just to bring it up to a state of good repair, let alone to provide new options for people. My bill critically included frequency, which would really help with ridership. Their bill has no decent policy in it. They don't understand transportation. Then rail, Amtrak's doing pretty well, but high speed rail didn't and I very much hope to come up with a different novel high-speed rail category. Then social equity, again, under-funded in the Senate bill. Didn't include my sidebars for affordable housing and to prevent gentrification, which has happened in a couple of cases where we removed freeways. Great, we've just rejoined a community that's been split asunder, and now they're all being driven out. So, I'm not sure how we can deal with that under the Dead Guy Rule, so-called Reconciliation, the Byrd rule, but we're going to try and deal with that. Wastewater is a tiny fraction of the investment we need and way less than I had in my bill. I'm hoping to increase wastewater. I'm hoping also to figure out how to bring back in a green infrastructure for wastewater, which has tremendous promise in addition to methane capture and electricity generation. And then certainly again, I partnered with Frank Pallone on this, drinking water and lead pipe removal were way under-funded. Hopefully we can deal with those things. And then EV  charging is very lacking also, and they didn't include Park and Rides. I mean, seriously, I know that truck stops were fighting viciously against including rest areas, but I didn't know anybody was against EV charging at Park and Rides. Unless you're trying to tell people not to take transit. I don't get that one. It might by a that might be a Toomey amendment as he hates transit. I don't know.
Linda Bauer Darr: You said that high-speed rail didn't get what you felt it deserved. And then, of course, Amtrak did pretty well. I imagine that had to be one of the President's "This is the deal, and you're going to have to accept it." I imagine it was a huge priority for him. And probably also something that ultimately was pushed by Senator Carper. Obviously their long-term friendship was helpful.
Chair DeFazio: Carper didn't have a voice in writing this bill. I talked to him. They did not consult the chairs of the committees of jurisdiction. It was written by the likes of Sinema and Portman and Collins and a cabal of other people and Manchin who got his $8 billion for blue hydrogen, which by the way, if you read the New York Times three days ago—and I've known this for a long time—so-called blue hydrogen is more polluting than CNG. And there are a lot of elements in that bill that are parochial and not dealing with climate change and not dealing with the investments we need to make.
Linda Bauer Darr: So how does this all get worked out? You put a lot of time and effort into your bill. It goes over to the Senate and the Senate has negotiated, or some of the leaders in the Senate have negotiated, with the President. We've got it through the Senate. Now we have to come back together. How does this play out ultimately, and how can you have a voice in this process?
Chair DeFazio: We are going to have a voice in the process because Reconciliation originates in the United States House of Representatives. We are intending both for the Build Back Better agenda, the things the President wants to do for families, for childcare—so more women can get into the workforce—all those things, in addition to what we can do to at least mitigate some of the shortcomings of the Senate infrastructure bill. Which is why we are pairing the two together. If we moved this infrastructure bill tomorrow, first off, it doesn't go into effect until October 1st, so what's the rush? And secondly, I predict that then we wouldn't even get a Reconciliation bill. It's very likely that wouldn't happen. Often around here, the next thing doesn't happen.
Chair DeFazio: I remember when I voted against Obama's recovery act because they had dramatically reduced real investment in jobs, investment in infrastructure, school construction, and other things for tax cuts too small to notice because of that jerk Larry Summers. I tried to get Jim Oberstar to vote the whole committee against it, and I said, Jim, we've got to fix this. He said, "No.They promised me the next thing would be a big infrastructure bill," which then Obama killed. So next thing never happens around here. And that's my opinion on Reconciliation. If we were to just blithely pass. without addressing some of these concerns in the infrastructure bill, we would never see reconciliation.
Linda Bauer Darr: You've talked a lot about sustainability and climate and those issues are very important, and frankly that engineering plays an enormous role in—as well as equity—so, you've been vocal about these things. What are the other differences that you see in the Senate bill that stand out to you as red flags?
Chair DeFazio: The fact that there is more investment in promoting fossil fuels, requiring that one quarter of the zero-emission buses be fossil fuel buses, allowing the transfer of half the funds into highways, no fix-it-first provisions. Not to make states look at whether more lanes are the best way to go. Senator Kaine tried to do this as an amendment in the Senate because Virginia is the poster child for this. Republicans were in charge. They said, More lanes on 95. It's backed up all the time." But the projections were, in 10 years with two more lanes, one each way, that it would be just as congested as it is today with induced demand and no alternatives at a cost of 10 to $12 billion.
Chair DeFazio: And they instead are coming up with an innovative rail project, working with CSX, new right-of-way, new bridge over the Potomac River for rail, the other one's at 99 percent of capacity. CSX likes it. And they're going to run fast trains—not high-speed trains—but fast trains down to Richmond from DC at half the cost, reducing all that pollution. And they have great projections on how much it'll reduce congestion. I was doing a press conference with the mayor of Richmond and he said he never really wanted to be a bedroom community in DC, but it's way less expensive down here. So, things like that that were left out, and they're going to be hard to fix. The other thing is that Secretary Buttigieg under this bill is going to have $100 billion of discretionary grants. I'm working with the White House on how we're going to mitigate some of the boneheadedness in the Senate bill through that $100 billion dollars of discretionary spending.
Linda Bauer Darr: That brings to mind years ago when I was at the Department of Transportation, and they were talking about a talent drain, how people were leaving government. And the last Administration, obviously, made an effort to reduce the size of government. How are we prepared in the Department of Transportation to take this money and run with it, considering a lot of it is going to be discretionary and there's going to be a process that needs to be taken on?
Chair DeFazio: I'm hopeful that DOT will act with unusual dispatch, and hopefully this won't require a lot of laborious rulemaking. I'm not totally conversant with the details of the discretionary money yet, but we will certainly look at ways to expedite it. If DOT needs more staff to deal with these things or people with different talents, I'd be happy to look at dealing with that either in Reconciliation or in appropriations. I'm already looking at that with the FAA. They lack inspectors both to deal with air rage and with ongoing problems with the industry and the manufacturers. So, if other parts of DOT have been hollowed out—I wasn't aware of DOT getting as hollowed out as the State Department or a whole bunch of other agencies that Trump decimated—but I'll ask on my next conversation with the Secretary what he needs.
Linda Bauer Darr: Well, that'd be interesting, if after all this effort, we ran into that bureaucracy, when the money is finally flowing towards projects, that we are all excited to get started on. So, this one is not a question. It's really more a word of thanks. You know that the engineering industry is facing a challenge among firms that took these PPP loans to save jobs and are now being told that they have to give those forgiven loans back because of a quirk in the Federal Acquisition Regulations. You and your great staff on the T&I Committee were very helpful in getting language attached to the Invest Act to lessen the impact of the problem. It didn't make it through in the Senate. At one point, we were making great progress with Senator Braun and some others who had actually even expanded on the work that you did. We were excited about that. Ultimately, it got held up by the process. A lot of the amendments that had a good support behind them fell out, particularly by Rand Paul. He was kind of the party killer. We were very close to getting it done.
Linda Bauer Darr: If it comes back to the House, I hope that we're going to be able to count on your support. We've talked about this issue before. It really is unfair. We've got contractors and everyone else that contracts with the government being treated differently than the engineering industry. We're being pulled out and told that "This money that you were given as basically a grant. Well, everybody else doesn't have to give it back, but we're going to take it out of your hides going forward in future projects. So, in some cases you're not going to be paid for the work that you're doing." That, to me, is just insane. We're hoping very much that we're going to be able to get this taken care of, and we hope that will be something that's important to you as well.
Chair DeFazio: It's important. It's outrageous. I was not a big fan of the PPP program. The restrictions that were put on people. This is one glaring example. The fraud that occurred through that program. The thing I did for aviation, the Payroll Support Program, had zero fraud and no questions. I know the fix I did in the House wasn't everything you wanted. Unfortunately, I don't have complete jurisdiction. I deal with two other committees who objected. I didn't know how close you came in the Senate. And it's sad that that's a body where one person can stop something that has I think extraordinary merit and we'll continue to work on it, continue to work with the green eyeshade people at DOT, and see what we can do in the House.
Chair DeFazio: We’re very bound by the Dead Guy Rule, the so-called Byrd rule, the Reconciliation rules, but we'll see what we can do. Policy is tough under his rules. It's pretty absurd that we're held up by a rule written by a Senator dead 12 years and written 28 years ago. It makes no sense to me. And the Senate does have discretion, which they seem loathe to use to just have the chair rule things in order. And then it takes 60 votes to overrule the chair, which turns the filibuster on its head and ultimately in a good reconciliation bill, if the parliamentarian and seance with Robert Byrd is saying, you can't do these things, I'm hopeful that the Senate leadership puts Harris in the chair to rule it in order. And then the Republicans are going to have to get 60 votes to overturn her ruling. And they can just go forward with the bill with 50 votes.
Linda Bauer Darr: We will be in there pitching, and we'll do everything that we can to try to make sure that people have the information they need to make a decision. We absolutely appreciate, again, your support and hope that we can continue to count on it, which it sounds like we can. It's just the process and anything can happen with the process, so let's work towards that. Let's assume and hope that we're successful and we get this major infrastructure package to the president's desk this year. Then what? Other than a vacation, clearly, what's next on your list of committee priorities? What else is up?
Chair DeFazio: We’ve already started working on the Water Resources Development Act, which we try to do every two years. And this time not to use the around-the-barn, indirect way of funding individual projects. I intend to go through a similar process to that that I went forward with, which is very rigorous and scandal free on member directed spending, in the Surface Transportation bill, which, by the way, I haven't given up on yet, We have some ideas of reconciliation. Although individually we can't do a projects, we have some ideas. And then some water resources, Coast Guard authorization, reforms at the Federal Emergency Management Agency I'm hoping in reconciliation to create a new pre-development program substantially funded at the Economic Development Administration, which could help a lot of the smaller communities who don't even know how to begin to try to access a federal grants for wastewater, drinking water, housing, or any other thing that relates to economic development. So that that's also something that we'll be working on, plus all the usual burdens of oversight and trying to get the money out the door. This bill will go into effect October 1st, and we want to have a really robust construction season.
Linda Bauer Darr: We're with you on hoping for that. I know you don't have a lot more time, but you did reference member-directed projects, which to me is code for earmark. Is that right?
Chair DeFazio: Yes, except technically an earmark is something the Appropriations Committee does that isn't authorized. We always did designated spending in surface transportation bills in the House, and they always went through a legislative process. In the Senate, not so much. Things got airdropped in. We went through a rigorous process. 109 Republicans and almost all the Democrats had projects up to $20 million. They had to work with their local governments with their states. And there are a lot of really good projects in there that the state bureaucracy or the federal bureaucracy is never going to get to in people's districts. It was about 1 percent of the bill, and I'm still working on that because I think it has a lot of merit. There are some ways—I’m not going to go into detail—but we have a couple ideas to get around the Dead Guy rule.
Linda Bauer Darr: You and I had talked about this over a year ago. I'm with you on the need to give the members some ownership of these projects, give them something to bring back to their communities, because frankly they're there to represent their communities and make the case for their communities when infrastructure projects are required. It seems to me like this is an even bigger issue than what we're working on with infrastructure. It's the ability for Congress to collaborate and compromise. The opportunity to  reach across the aisle and say, “I want to help you on this priority. Will you help me on this?” Or “I can do this. It's just doing business.” And it seems like when we were deprived of that. Regular order came to a halt, the wheels of Congress grinded to the halt, and there was less bipartisanship as a result. So, I think you feel passionately about that. I know we at ACEC feel very passionately about it. I think it's important going forward. We thank you for recognizing that. And you know, before we wrap, I am curious, how did you go about vetting those member requests? That's got to be a difficult job, right?
Chair DeFazio: It just about killed the staff. We brought in hired some additional staff. First we had to get a vendor to create a software program. And then they had to be submitted online, posting online all of their documentation, showing local support, affidavits of no pecuniary interest, all those things that in the past led to scandals. Plus, obviously, I created equity. I got 20 million bucks and the newest freshmen got 20 million bucks. And you can do a lot. I spread it around between wastewater that'll help a small port in my district attract a fish processor, worked with the port of Coos Bay on rail sidings that will enhance the port activity and get more product on rail instead of truck, and I had a number of projects for electric buses and multi-modal facilities. There were a lot of things that people liked.
Chair DeFazio: Quick story, when the whole earmark thing blew up back after ‘06 and the Tea Party came in and they got this bad name and Republicans banned them. I was down in my second most conservative county. Most of my counties are red except for two. And a guy stood up and said that earmarks are horrible. And I said, “I know there have been some issues, but what do you think about the Weaver River Road bridge,” which is a bridge over the freeway that opened up an industrial park. He was “Wow. It's great.” And I said, “Sir, that was an earmark. He said, “That wasn't bad.” And I said, “Yeah, the state wasn't going to do it and the county couldn't afford it. I got it done.” I did a lot of them in my years on the committee and there's never been a scandal. I had some people object to joining North Bend and Coos Bay with a bike path, but tourism is a really important part of our economy.
Linda Bauer Darr: That’s a great example there. And who knows better than your constituents about what the needs are and who is better positioned to deliver for them than you, but you have to have that opportunity. The reason for us having this federal program is because it all needs to tie together ultimately. It's like the circulatory system of the body, right? At the center of it maybe is the federal government, but then the state portions and the local portions go out from there and they need to be right on, and we need to make sure that the blood is flowing between the heart and the end of the system and make sure that all the communities are weighing in and earmarks are a way for us to do that. So, we agree with you. It's good for the nation, and I think, it's good for government. And it's good for your constituents ultimately. So again, thanks for being bold and going forward with that, because I don't think without your pushing that it would have entered into the frame again. So, thank you for that.
Chair DeFazio: Okay. I enjoyed doing the interview. Liddy and I have done three Zooms in a row. She needs a break.
Host: So. Mr. Chairman, I do appreciate it. And thank you for your time today. Good luck in the legislative session ahead. And we appreciate your strong voice for the built environment and for infrastructure. And we do appreciate for everything that you do, and Linda, thank you very much for joining us today on the program. Thank you.
Chair DeFazio: Thanks Jeff. Thanks Linda. Hi to everybody who listens to this podcast.
Host: And again, this has been Engineering Influence, a podcast from the American Council of Engineering Companies. We will see you next time.

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A Conversation with ACEC Board Chair Robin Greenleaf

ACEC Board Chair Robin Greenleaf sat down on the program to discuss her experiences to this point in her term.
Host:
Welcome to another edition of Engineering Influence, a podcast from the American Council of engineering companies. And today we are very pleased to be joined by our board chair, Robin Greenleaf and full disclosure - we actually did this before and we had a technical issue, right when Robin was elevated to chair, we had a podcast scheduled and then the file for some reason in the cloud, the gremlins in the system never actually transferred the file. So, we're doing it again, but now we have a little bit more time has passed and Robin has been engaged in a number of things. I mean, summer ExCom has happened. We've had a number of things occur, so it's going to be great to get her kind of impressions and thoughts about where, where things stand with ACEC and her outlook as chair. So Robin, thank you very much for joining the program once more.
Greenleaf :
Jeff, I'm happy to be here and you're right. I think that I went from having what was a part-time job to a more than full-time job. So happy to have a chance to talk about it.
Host:
Yeah. You have really hit the ground running. And you've been traveling - you've been in Washington, DC multiple times for different events, both at the townhouse and then the office, of course we have the summer ExCom at Mackinac Island. I think I'm pronouncing that correctly. I'm not sure, but in Michigan, sorry for those Michiganders if I did pronounce that incorrectly, but yet the summer ended up ExCom in person. I really, I, you know, from, we spoke early when you just took the office and, and now we're at the beginning of August, where are things right now with ACEC as you see them, how has it changed over that time?
Greenleaf :
So I think that at this point we have the two biggest issues that we were facing that were on the radar screen, but had not really gotten started to the degree I'm seeing now is infrastructure and the PPP FAR credit issue, and both are in full-blown things are happening minute to minute. It's very exciting that, you know, the House got their bill done. And then the Senate went and put a bipartisan bill together, which is, is I think, going to happen. And I'm very interested in seeing what happens to the Senate bill when it gets back to the House. There's a lot of I think there's still a ways to go there, but it looks like we may have a trillion dollar infrastructure bill in the short term, which would be fantastic for our industry. And I think that the the issue with the PPP FAR credit clause has gone from getting traction in the House to at this point. What I'm hearing is that we are very close to having a bipartisan group of senators who are willing to put an amendment in the manager's amendment for a full waiver on the issue, which would be huge for so many of our members. So, you know, we'll know more in the coming days and see what happens when it goes back to the House.
Host:
It really is amazing. We've been talking about this for months. This has been such a long process and when it finally picks up speed, as we saw last week with the cloture vote, and now with a 20 little over 2000 page two, I think 2,207 page bipartisan bill finally introduced yesterday on Sunday, we're recording this on Monday the 2nd. And then the expectation that the Senate could move the past as soon as Thursday if they're able to get through some of the other barriers that they have on amendment debate, and then getting it over to the House and potentially having something by the late September, let's say mid, mid to late September wants the House comes back at the end of their August recess to get something on the president's desk and get it signed into law. It's amazing how, how fast things have picked up.
Greenleaf :
There's still things that we need to keep our eye on. I think that hearing that the Speaker of the House is wanting to tie the reconciliation bill to getting this through. You know, there's still some hurdles to clear, but yeah, I think in terms of our own issues and, and being so close to having a great resolution to a big issue, probably one of the bigger issues I've seen since I've been active with ACEC you know, I'm just keeping fingers and toes crossed that we get there.
Host:
Absolutely. And I, this is a great time for our members that are listening, that, you know, the Senate is going to be doing their work this week and the House is already out in recess, but in no way, does that mean the process is going to stop. Negotiations are going to continue. They're going to ramp up if anything, and it's the perfect time with those members back in their districts to meet with them and educate them on why this bill is so important, not only to your business, but also to the economy as a whole, and then to show them as much as you possibly can, the work that you do and to crystallize in their mind. So when they come back to Washington at the end of the recess, that they have one thought in their mind, which is, this is a bill that has to pass because those complications, as you mentioned, the $3.5 trillion reconciliation bill that Speaker Pelosi and the House Progressives are, are very firm on addressing first, before they talk touch infrastructure is something which is a, is, is a slight complicating factor instead of just dealing with one bill.
Host:
So this is a great time to educate members and that's something our grassroots does a great job of, and it's just continue that and keep that pressure on.
Greenleaf :
Yeah, I agree.
Host:
So what else has kind of changed when we talked early on in the spring? Of course we had a couple of things that were, were key items that you were working on first of course, is the three-year budget cycle. And that was addressed during, during, you know, the, the board meeting. It was addressed again during ExCom meeting, you know, that as well as our initiatives related to the Strategic Plan, especially on diversity and inclusion and add changing the name of the committee so that now it includes the word belonging and, and opening that committee up to as many people who can join. So where, where do things kind of stand right there? And how is that, where is that in the list of priorities for you today?
Greenleaf :
Well, sure. So let me address the budget issue first, because that's ongoing. We've had a couple of meetings with the budget committee. I just had a financial oversight meeting just prior to starting the podcast. And we have another budget committee meeting on August 9th and staff has done a great job putting together the preliminary numbers for what the next three years looks like. And they look okay, you know, kind of pleased that it looks like we're going to be able to put together a good stable, predictable budget. There are still things that need to be fine tuned. And once we get this all together, Matt Hirst, our treasurer will present it at the October meeting. And then we'll start a series of town hall type meetings with our national directors and the executive directors to just make sure that everybody understands what goes into the budget process.
Greenleaf :
If they have questions about things that they see would want to make sure that we're very transparent about just giving good information so that, that every single number in that budget is defendable. And and then for the DEI and belonging committee, they they're up and running. And you know, Lisa Brothers is doing a great job pulling that committee together and moving ahead on their goals. So I think that it's something it's an open committee, anyone can join, and it's a great way to, to participate in moving our organization towards being diverse and inclusive. And, and you know, for me, the word that really resonates is belonging, because that is if I was going to describe kind of why I've stayed in the organization for as many years as I have, it would be because of the sense of belonging I experience when I'm with fellow members.
Greenleaf :
The planning cabinet is hard at work on developing the metrics for the strategic plan. And we have a meeting in August that I'm thinking is still going to be an in-person meeting to go through each of the subcommittees. You know, they all, they went through each of the five pieces of the strategic plan, and there's a group working on each one on what, what are the metrics for success to be able to know that the plan is working as it should. And we'll probably take some of the research that comes out of that and pull it back to the budget and make sure that, that the entire strategic plan is financially supported, where it should be.
Host:
Yeah, that's something which I know that our team is working on as well, assisting with that metric building process, which is extremely important that you need to know what you're measuring, so you can actually get to success. And it's interesting going through that process of finding out exactly, you know, what, what, what can we measure, where, where do we need to build up our capabilities for measurement? You know, what are our targets for actually, you know, being able to check the box on some of these items, but to that point, I mean, throughout COVID throughout the pandemic of last year into, into, of course this year, implementing against that strategic plan has been still our, our focus here. It's been making sure that we're always pushing that ball forward. So it'll be interesting to see what that meeting this month, you know results in as far as moving forward.
Greenleaf :
Yeah. I'm looking forward to it.
Host:
Now you are also taking this message to our members far and wide. You have been traveling a lot over the past couple of weeks and you have more scheduled. I know that most, I guess, most immediate you have the Summer Coalitions meeting, which is a Nashville in-person you're as a former coalitions leader, yourself, someone who has some very some very personal knowledge of the coalitions and its importance to ACEC, what are you hoping to, to tell them what are you hoping to to encourage them about when it comes to ACEC Coalitions?
Greenleaf :
So I was one of a few people back, and this was a long time ago. I, I need to look up and see when we got CAMEE up and running. And so my experience with, with the CAMEE Coalition, which is Coalition of American Mechanical and Electrical Engineers, is that there was a practice group that we always got together as a committee at the fall conferences. And there became this moment where it just coalesced into being something more. And we realized that if we had a more formal group with an executive committee and you know, our real mission that we could start moving our practice group into just greater value within the association. And I think that that's what all of the coalitions bring at this point. It's, it's something more than a committee it's why we feel that it's okay to be charged a small amount of dues to be a member, because there are products that are being developed. And they're very specific to each of the disciplines, whether it's contracts or kind of client evaluation tools, or self evaluation tools, they're all really, really helpful. And the message I want to deliver at the coalitions meeting next week is that yeah, I think ACEC across the board at the national level has recognized the value of the coalitions and really wants to support the work of all of them.
Host:
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's evidenced by our new Coalitions Director, Michelle Kroger. She came on, she is working on on an initiative for new members coming in of a, a year of free coalition membership, which is a great member benefit. Given the fact that, you know, number one is it's not a significant amount of, of, of investment money-wise to join a coalition, but the benefits you get from coalition membership are just so, you know, so outweigh whatever you spend to actually be part of it. As well as a new look we have kind of a new coalition logo and look, that's going along with them. We're trying to get a brand going that kind of establishes coalitions as its own entity within the ACEC family. And to get a little bit more of a, of a highlight there. So that's going to be very interesting again, it's great the fact that we actually meet in person back in Nashville and in next week really next week,
Greenleaf :
I think it's a week from today from today. I have to think I'm thinking back through where I've been going really....
Host:
Recap for the audience where you've been so far, because again, you know, with all these travel issues going around airlines like American, just canceling every, every other flight, it seems you've been a trooper you've been, you've been really hitting the road. We're where have you been and what do you have coming up?
Greenleaf :
So I've already been to, I'm going to start with the townhouse. If I can put in a plug for the townhouse, then, then I'll get into the, the emo meetings. The townhouse is an incredible resource and having been there for at least half a dozen meetings with, with congresspeople at this point where you're in a small group setting, they walk in, they look around, they go, wow, this is great. And then they get to work with Dave Bender to schedule future meetings of their own, but you get an hour or sometimes more sitting in a very small group of people being able to talk about ACEC issues and agenda and how can they help us and how can we help them? And the conversations are just incredibly productive. And I think before I went down to the deep south conference, I was in Washington Monday through Wednesday of that week and had an opportunity to meet with Seth Moulton, who's a Congressmen from Massachusetts and on the T&I committee and hearing about you know, what, what he's hoping that this infrastructure bill will accomplish.
Greenleaf :
And we had a very, very small group of us meeting with Jim McGovern Congressman from Massachusetts as well. Who's Chair of the Rules Committee. And he may play a really key role in our PPP issue when it goes back to the house. So really good to spend some time with him. The next step on the tour was the Deep South Conference, and it was great to attend their Executive Committee meeting and hear what the issues are in Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi Tennessee, Florida. And then I had the honor of doing their officer installation at lunch on the last day, which is a lot of fun. And it's a real pleasure. I just love doing that. And then I was home for a couple of days. Then I just got back from the ACEC North Carolina conference and know it's another great group of people.
Greenleaf :
And it's, it's wonderful to see people in person. It's great to be part of round tables and realize that that no matter where I go, I hear a lot of the same issues and people are really, I won't say struggling. That's not the right word, but front and center is the return to work issue for so many of our members and, and across the country, it's a lot of the same experiences. Let's see. Tomorrow. I am flying to Palm beach for the ACEC Florida conference. And then next week I'll be in Nashville for the Coalitions meeting and then off to Anchorage, Alaska to attend the ACEC Life Health Trust meeting, and then back for a couple of days, and then off to DPC and then planning cabinet. Then I'm taking a break.
Host:
That is, that is a schedule. So never, never wonder out there, if you're listening, what does the ACEC board chair do? Here's a good example of it. They go everywhere and they talk to everyone in the end, they learn firsthand, you know, what our member firms were experiencing the troubles that were or opportunities that they see ahead of them. And then working with the staff here to, to make sure they're addressed. I mean, this is, this is the, the, the, this is what you need the boots on the ground kind of conversations to really keep the Federation connected.
Greenleaf :
It's, it's really interesting. And one of the things I learned in North Carolina, which is different than my experience in my home state of Massachusetts, is that when the PPP loan program got put into place when they, when treasury made it tax deductible on the federal side, there's still a lot of states that didn't do similar legislation to make it tax deductible on the state side, Massachusetts, it was done here very quickly and that's great, but in North Carolina, that piece of legislation is stalled. So yeah, it's just great to be able to hear what the issues are. And yeah, I have a lot of empathy for, for the different experiences I'm hearing about,
Host:
You know, given what you've seen so far, what you've experienced, you know, when you were chair-elect during the height of the pandemic, really and you know, where we sit right now, you know, what's your overall feeling about where things are going and where's ACEC is going you know, what's your, what's your gut take confidence level of, of you know, right track, you know, what do you think?
Greenleaf :
I think ACEC is very much on the right track. I think that I'm hearing by and large, most firms are busy and have, have reasonable backlog. And their expectation is that 2021 is going to be a good year. I think there's still a lot of hesitancy on the return to work issue that I've already mentioned. I think that the resurgence of COVID pretty much across the country is giving people pause. And yet I'm hearing a lot of confidence that you know, if you've been vaccinated that you can still go travel, go visit people and, you know, continue to hold in-person meetings with, with some degree of caution. And so, yeah, and I'll put in a plug for our October meeting. I am not hearing, you know, I think, I think that you know, one thing that I saw recently is the DPC meeting is coming up and it will be an in-person meeting. I think that, that there is some caution that, you know, it's probably better to be vaccinated, to go attend in person, to keep everybody as healthy as possible. And, you know, and so when we do something like that for the October conference, I don't know, I think that's a pretty preliminary conversation, but probably worth. We're thinking about, so, and I'm not hearing any, any hesitance about not holding the conference
Host:
And we've been very - Mike and his team, the meetings team has been very clear with the hotel, the host hotel, the Marriott, to make sure that, you know, their health and safety standards are top-notch that, you know, the safety and the health of our guests and our attendees at the event is top of mind for us. And that's why we have it. We have a post of what Marriott's doing up on the fall conference page. It's something that we're continually monitoring. So, but I think you're absolutely right. You know, the numbers that we've seen when we've done some surveys, that the desire is there to come back and meet in person. And, you know, we're, we're working to put together a program that's going to make it worth your time. And I think that it's going to be great to get everyone together again, for all the great stuff that happens in fall. And, and to really, I think we learned a lot during the virtual events, that's actually gonna benefit going back in person and hosting the event in person. It's kind of a strange thing where having to move everything to a virtual environment kind of made us rethink some things. And, and, and, and I think it's going to translate back in person to, to an, even better to an even better event. So registration's open, I'll make a plug registration is open - acec.org.
Greenleaf :
You know, when you go to a conference and the two that have already been to the thing that is so different about in-person is, you know, I might hear somebody say something and I'm able to go walk up to them afterwards and say, hey, you mentioned this you know, about what you're doing with your office in your return to work strategy. And this is what I'm thinking about. And then you end up having a drink at the bar, just continue the conversation. You can't do that in a zoom setting. And those are the invaluable conversations.
Host:
Yeah, absolutely. Now, without question. So we're, we're hoping that everyone takes advantage of that both, you know, attendees, exhibitors alike. And and again, you know, registration is open up on acec.org. We invite you to go up and take a look and we're adding stuff to the schedule every week. And and we hope to see you there October. What else is going on? What do I guess, you know, I want to be respectful of your time. What other things would you like to make sure our audience knows, you know about what you're working on and what you're seeing ahead of us.
Greenleaf :
So I think one of the things that I'm becoming very aware of is there's been a lot of discussion about our research Institute. And when I was at the the deep south conference in their executive committee meeting, Daphne Bryant was there with us. She made a great presentation about the Institute and, and it's something that even, I didn't have a full enough appreciation for just what it brings to us as an organization. And one of the things that that came up was that through the Institute, we have the ability to really stay out in front of the organization with issues that they may not be on our radar screen yet, or they may just beginning to be. And so we've got a group of people that can go and find the experts to conduct really forward-thinking research for us. And what it does for us as an association is just adds this extra bandwidth to what we do. And I think that, that I, that's the way I think of the Institute at that at this point, it's not even frosting on the cake. It's just having this ability to look ahead. And, and then what we do is use that research to help prepare our members for what may be coming that we haven't really thought through yet.
Host:
No, absolutely. I think the the research they did initially on the economic modeling, the profiling and the contribution report has been extremely helpful. We were able to take that and apply that to the infrastructure bill. So as you notice, everything that we put out, even on social media, and we encourage everyone who is meeting with Members of Congress to do the same is to talk about that economic benefit, because now we have the numbers to prove it. We can say that the bipartisan bill would add 82,000 new jobs in our sector of the economy. However, thanks to the work of the ACEC Research Institute, we know that for every new engineering job created, two more are added in roles that support or benefit from engineering.  That means a total of 246,000 new jobs will be added to the economy over six years. Now we can talk about GDP contribution. We can talk about the addition of $62 billion in A/E industry wages, actual numbers that can serve as the foundation for any argument we make on the benefits of investing in engineering. And then of course the research that they have upcoming that they're going to be there, there, there are a number of pieces of research that are in development right now, which we, we do feel that are going to be very beneficial to our members from the Institute.
Greenleaf :
It's all great stuff.
Host:
And yeah, so there was a lot happening. This is an exciting time to be chair, I hope. And, and you're making the most out of it. So that's, that's the important thing and, and, you know safe travels on your, on your trips ahead. It's going to be a busy time. You're going to pretty much crisscross the lower 48, and then you're going to head over to Alaska for the life health trust meetings. So that's, that's something that's something in itself. But we do appreciate you taking the time today, Robin, thank you very much for joining us.
Greenleaf :
I'm happy to be here, Jeff, thank you for the opportunity.
Host:
Anytime. And again, this has been another episode of Engineering Influence podcast from the American Council of Engineering Companies. We'll see you next time.
 
 

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Kevin Holland of Lockton's Engineering and Design Practice joined the program to talk about the current situation with cybercrime, its frequency in the engineering industry, cybersecurity insurance, and what firms can do to protect themselves.

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In September Marohn will publish his next book on this subject, titled Confessions of a Recovering Engineer: Transportation for a Strong Town.
The book looks at how transportation infrastructure and the values and assumptions behind it drive development in this country and offers an alternative, one that clashes in a lot of places with current engineering and cultural thinking.

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We welcomed Matt Reiffer from ACEC's advocacy team to the show to discuss the week's failed cloture vote on infrastructure and what it means for the future of the bipartisan infrastructure package.